This week, Agile Santa (Dan Neumann), your host, is joined by Hal Hogue, Misi Eyetsemitan, Alba Uribe, Rosemary Atanga, and Jesus Gerardo de la Fuente Garcia in this very special Christmas Special. Agile Santa is taking some Christmas requests from these very special coaches as well as listening to what they are grateful for about this year’s work.
- Gerardo tells Agile Santa his favorite part of this year’s work and what is on his Agile Santa list
- Having a global and multicultural team
- Team members have served their stakeholders, delivering value and outcomes, and also used the Sprint Reviews to showcase their work
- Gerardo wishes to be better at story mapping
- Hal talks to Agile Santa
- Hal is grateful for working with people, getting involved with agile teams, helping them understand the way behind the tasks they are working on, and growing as individuals, as teams, and even helping entire organizations with their own agile transformation
- Hal confesses that he struggles sometimes with being judgmental, so he has been reminding himself to be curious instead
- Hal wishes he could know his clients and coworkers personally, on a more human level
- Elf Misi presents Coach Alba who shares her wishes with Agile Santa
- Alba wishes to have organizations embrace an agile mindset, understanding all the value that agile can bring
- Elf Misi introduces Rosemary to Agile Santa and she shares her Christmas wishes with him
- Rosemary has been a good coach, looking after everybody on her team, making sure they are doing what they are supposed to do, and giving them the support that they needed
- Rosemary wishes Agile Santa makes real all the outstanding things agile teams are waiting to happen
- Rosemary asks for consistent encouragement and motivation
Mentioned in this Episode:
Transcript [This transcript is auto-generated and may not be completely accurate in its depiction of the English language or rules of grammar.]
Intro: [00:03] Welcome to the Agile Coaches’ Corner by AgileThought. The podcast for practitioners and leaders seeking advice to refine the way they work and pave the path to better outcomes. Now here’s your host, coach and agile expert, Dan Neumann.
Dan Neumann: [00:18] Ho ho ho. Oh, welcome to this episode of the Agile Coaches’ Corner podcast, your regular host Dan Neumann can’t be here, so you’ve got agile Santa today. Ho ho ho, you can’t wait to see how this goes, oh boy. Yeah, I’m going to be taking Christmas requests from some of my favorite coaches. Oh, and the first one we’ve got is Gerardo de la Fuente. Gerardo! Have you been a good coach this year?
Gerardo de la Fuente: [00:54] I think I, yes. And you know, I, I have been working with different teams and they have have different challenges. And I think that as a, as a teacher, I, we have been helping them understanding the Scrum framework, changing the agile mindset and also the culture and, and some behaviors. However, I have to be honest with you, Santa, there are things that I need to improve. You know, we also align to this continuous improvement. I see that there is a point that I, I think that I can, I, I can do better. And that’s one of them.
Dan Neumann: [01:39] Did you call anybody stupid this year?
Gerardo de la Fuente: [01:42] No, even though there was in my mind. No. I was chill, calm, and kind of resilient.
Dan Neumann: [01:55] Yeah. That’s good. It’s important for a coach to kind of keep a level mind when they’re doing this. You can’t call ’em stupid.
Gerardo de la Fuente: [02:06] You’re right.
Dan Neumann: [02:07] So no, no, you can’t do that. So that’s good. I, I checked my list here. It looks like you’ve been pretty good at that, that teaching thing. What, what was your favorite part of the year so far?
Gerardo de la Fuente: [02:18] So far was having global team multi cultural team. And that opened me my horizon as well, to understand the way of their thinking their culture, and also understanding that, for example, in, in this particular team, they came from a very profound waterfall mindset. For me, it was a very interesting challenge to start making this change with them, explaining them our Scrum values, our Scrum principles, and how our goal is to serve our stakeholders, delivering value, delivering outcomes that that are good, that are valuable for, for the, for them and for the business. So that’s something that open also their, their, their eyes and their minds. And also that they have the opportunity to have this spotlight, for example, on the Sprint reviews of showcasing their work, how many times in other, in, in this traditional way of doing things that the team only develops and then delivers, but they don’t have no credit. It, it is also, it is on kind kind of mechanic. So here it is different. They have the opportunity to showcase their craft and to receive the pluses from the stakeholders, and also to receive those feedback. There is very good. So we can be on this continuous improvement process as well.
Dan Neumann: [03:58] Oh, feedback for really good. I got some feedback for you, young man. I’ve I heard, I’ve heard that you’re really into this podcasting stuff. And so I wanted to let you know, I heard good things from Dan and, and he really enjoyed having you on there and your enthusiasm for the podcast. So thanks for that. Gerardo that, that puts you on the nice list. You can, you can hop out there to iTunes and leave a, leave a little positive review. That’s what you can do there Gerardo but what what’s on your Christmas Santa list, your agile Santa list. I, I don’t wanna hear about little red wagons.
Gerardo de la Fuente: [04:39] Of course. And maybe my list is it is long, but I will give you one specific that I want I wish for that is to be better on the story mapping technique.
Dan Neumann: [04:55] Oh, have you listened to the podcast on story mapping?
Gerardo de la Fuente: [04:59] Yes. My friends, Alba and Mike outline it very good. And that’s part, part that’s of, of, of the change that we, we want to do, because we know that to have a successful team and deliver very good outcomes and valuable. It is important to understand the vision, understand the product goal. Understand what, what is the value that we’re going to deliver. So we need to make that breakdown, consciously with all the team so we can understand where are, where are we headed to?
Dan Neumann: [05:32] Oh, that sounds amazing. Oh, I tell you what Gerardo you should check your stocking here, because I hear, after the new year, we’re gonna have some bonus content in Spanish, and I heard that there’s a chance for you to do a whole bunch of that. So woo. You, you and our Spanish speaking listeners better be ready for some native Spanish, Agile Coaches’ Corner bonus episodes.
Gerardo de la Fuente: [05:57] it is going to be a bomb. Thank you, Santa. Thank you. A great, a great gift. Thank you.
Dan Neumann: [06:05] You’re welcome. And you make sure you take your kids to the not agile Santa that waterfall their Christmas list all day. Thanks Gerardo.
Gerardo de la Fuente: [06:18] Thank you, Santa.
Dan Neumann: [06:19] Oh boy. Who’s who’s next?
Hal Hogue: [06:23] I am, agile Santa. It’s me.
Dan Neumann: [06:26] Oh, Hal, and your dog too.
Hal Hogue: [06:30] And your dog, I can’t go anywhere without my dog.
Dan Neumann: [06:35] Yeah. How’s your dog?
Hal Hogue: [06:37] Oh, he is doing great. He, he and I are so are so excited to finally get to meet you agile Santa.
Dan Neumann: [06:46] You know, he was sleeping in the back. Oh, he moved. He’s awake. He’s up? Okay. Yeah. Oh, good for him.
Hal Hogue: [06:51] He is up and ready and ready to talk with you. Oh, this is, this is just, I’m sorry if I’m a little nervous. This is amazing to just to get to meet you Agile Santa.
Dan Neumann: [06:59] Santa is nervous too. He’s afraid. You’re gonna try and sit on his lap. And HR said we can’t have that this year. Yeah.
Hal Hogue: [07:07] We had that conversation earlier and unfortunately, yeah, we better skip that part.
Dan Neumann: [07:12] Oh yeah. Definitely not doing that. Yeah. So how is, how is Hal doing at this agile thing?
Hal Hogue: [07:19] Oh, great. I’m living. I’m living my dream. Agile Santa. I, I just love working with people getting involved with agile teams, helping them understand the why behind the things they’re doing and growing as individuals, as teams and even helping entire organizations with their, with their own agile transformations. So it’s just, it’s going. It’s going great, Agile Santa. Just great.
Dan Neumann: [07:48] That’s that’s good. I, I heard you were taking some of that Ted Lasso stuff and trying to apply that at, at your work too. Now you didn’t put, watch Ted Lasso on your time sheet, did you?
Hal Hogue: [08:00] No, I didn’t. No, unfortunately, but you know, I’ve, I’ve watched a fair bit of Ted lasso. You may notice I have a, a poster behind me.
Dan Neumann: [08:10] I was curious about that. Yeah.
Hal Hogue: [08:12] It, it reminds me to have, and show curiosity when working with people when coming into new environments and not, and not being judgemental and agile Santa, I, I have, I have to confess, I struggle with this sometimes. I, I realize that, and that’s part of the reason I have that poster behind me, because it helps remind me to be curious and not come from a place of judgment and try to try to understand why people are making the decisions they’re making and, and step back for a moment. And that, that really helps me. So I’m, I’m really working on that agile Santa. I am, I am sorry for the times I have been judgmental. I don’t know if you have that on your, your list.
Dan Neumann: [09:08] You know, it’s the elves were telling me about that, but I was like, no, that can’t be hell, he’s got the poster that says be curious.
Hal Hogue: [09:17] Yeah. You can’t trust elves, agile Santa. I know, I know you employ a lot of them, but they’re very, they’re really, really shifty.
Dan Neumann: [09:24] No, but you know, this, it’s hard to find good help right now. But we got, you know, elves that just, you know, they don’t wanna work anymore. Like they used to back in the day and I got my sleighs all backed up in the north pole there. They’re just waiting to be unloaded. Oh, it’s terrible.
Hal Hogue: [09:42] I actually, a friend of mine was actually a little curious about how that works. How, how does, does, does your workshop work in, in an agile way?
Dan Neumann: [09:52] Oh boy. That’s well I can’t give you all the secret, but we do have lean like where we really know what we’re doing. We, we apply Lean practices over there. You see, we drive the waste out of it, but then we’ve got, you know, your horizon tool, if you will, where we’re trying to figure out how to use all these sleighs, the other 364 days of the year. But you know, Uber’s got the food thing. So that’s a tough market. None. We got that secret horizon three stuff. And we, we don’t talk about that. Cause that’s super secret over there. Eh,
Hal Hogue: [10:23] I am interested in this horizon three business.
Dan Neumann: [10:27] Oh yeah. Well, you can’t tell you about that though. And just see Santa had some of his Canada come out there. Eh, so don’t know how that happened.
Hal Hogue: [10:34] Santa seems to be delivering or developing a bit of an accent.
Dan Neumann: [10:39] You try travel in the world. All, all, you know, all over the world, you pick up different accents. None of them are good.
Hal Hogue: [10:45] Yeah. You are. You are a world traveler
Dan Neumann: [10:48] That, oh yeah. I’m in Florida now.
Hal Hogue: [10:51] Oh, that’s exactly where I would assume agile Santa is for 364 days. Yeah.
Dan Neumann: [10:57] It’s great. Down here. So Hal what’s on your Santa list this year. The agile Santa. Not that bogus one.
Hal Hogue: [11:05] Yeah. Yeah. We won’t worry about him.
Dan Neumann: [11:07] Don’t worry about the bogus Santa he’s he’s a myth. Don’t tell Gerardo’s kids.
Hal Hogue: [11:13] I won’t. Secret’s safe.
Gerardo de la Fuente: [11:15] The secret remains with me.
Hal Hogue: [11:18] So here’s, here’s the thing. Agile Santa I’ve been getting involved with a new client. I’m coaching people I haven’t met before. We’re all working in, in a remote way. We’re all very distributed across the, not not just across the country, across the globe. And it’s very, it’s very interesting to, to get to know all of these people and help them work effectively, remotely. But I was thinking you agile Santa are, are a bit of a sourcer, a magician. Oh, a magician.
Dan Neumann: [11:55] We prefer magician. No, not source. Is that a, you got, yeah, there’s some really conservative types. They don’t like guy sneaking in their house once a year, whatever. Yeah.
Hal Hogue: [12:06] Okay. So you, yeah, you practice the magic arts and you, you are capable of traveling very long distances in very short periods of time. You know, and I was thinking, I would love to have that ability to quickly and easily go and visit my new colleagues and get to know on a more human and personal level. And sure. I guess I could hop on a, a plane and spend hours doing that and then have to deal with hotel rooms. But I was thinking if you could clue me in on that, that agile Santa magic, maybe, maybe I, it be your, your apprentice. I don’t know. That would cost me. Oh, okay. Well, could I, could I just borrow your powers for a couple of days and just go, go have some conversations with people.
Dan Neumann: [13:10] Have you tried drinking beers with them on zoom?
Intro: [13:14] It’s it’s not quite the same as drinking years within in. Person’s not quite. That’s true. It’s a good idea.
Dan Neumann: [13:21] Oh, it’s wonderful.
Hal Hogue: [13:22] But yeah, I’m, I’m just, just being able to be with these people in person is so valuable at, especially at the beginning of a big engagement. Oh yeah. Yeah. So yeah. If, if you are able to share your magic powers in any way, because they’re truly impressive. I gotta give you props agile Santa.
Dan Neumann: [13:45] Well, you know, the the, I heard the coaches at AgileThought. There did some team building recently on zoom a lot, some unstructured time where, you know, they were, oh, Jeez microphone. I got one of magic dumping microphones, but they the, the folks there at agile thought, you see, they were getting into little pods and breakout rooms and learning about each other. And then the rest of the people in the practice had to guess who the different clues were about. I liked the, I liked what I heard about that.
Hal Hogue: [14:15] Okay. So doing a little bit of, a little bit of gaming, a little bit of
Dan Neumann: [14:19] Well, meetings are so serious. God. Yeah. Start with the toast.
Hal Hogue: [14:22] You don’t have to be though agile Santa, do they?
Dan Neumann: [14:25] They don’t. No, no, you don’t even need beer to have fun in them, but it helps.
Hal Hogue: [14:30] You don’t.
Dan Neumann: [14:31] It helps, you know, especially when it’s cold. Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. Start team building. Thanks some time. I’d say. Yeah.
Hal Hogue: [14:40] I think I’ll try to do a little bit of that.
Dan Neumann: [14:42] We’ll give the show notes. We could put that exercise in the show notes.
Hal Hogue: [14:47] We could, yeah. Those show notes are valuable. Okay. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Agile Santa.
Dan Neumann: [14:53] And, and you let me know if Caity needs anything. I love Carity’s videos.
Hal Hogue: [14:57] Yeah. He’s not been a very good pig this year.
Dan Neumann: [14:59] Oh, he’s been bad pig. He’s been a bad pig.
Hal Hogue: [15:02] Yeah. I’m afraid.
Dan Neumann: [15:04] Oh, naughty pig. You better watch out for the bacon, man. Yeah. Okay. Wow.
Hal Hogue: [15:10] Wow. Agile Santa you’re throwing, throwing threats out there now.
Dan Neumann: [15:12] No, I’m just, you know, that’s between you and your conscience there.
Hal Hogue: [15:19] Thanks Agile Santa.
Dan Neumann: [15:19] I hope the next person doesn’t hear that. All right. Well, Hal, you have a wonderful Christmas and we’ll catch real soon again.
Hal Hogue: [15:33] Thank you. Agile Santa. That sounds ominous.
Dan Neumann: [15:37] Right? Oh boy it sure did. Didn’t it? A little bit. Let’s try. Oh, Hal have a good year. OK. Oh yeah. We’ll catch you later. Oh, catch you better lock that door. Hey, plug that chimney flu. Oh, I will creepy people come down there. Yeah. Okay. We’ll get you later.
Hal Hogue: [15:57] Thank you. Agile Santa.
Dan Neumann: [15:59] Okay. Who’s next. Oh, look, who’s joined Elf Misi, how are you doing?
Misi Eyetsemitan: [16:21] I’m doing awesome. Santa. Oh, looking forward to our friends today.
Dan Neumann: [16:24] I’m so glad you were able to join. You know, we were talking about how good help is hard to find. I’m assuming you, you had to reprimand some of those workshop elves there.
Misi Eyetsemitan: [16:34] I sure did. I sure did. You know how we get the Rukus in the workshop?
Dan Neumann: [16:39] Are they Scrum teams in the workshop?
Misi Eyetsemitan: [16:42] Loads of Scrum teams. You know that, you know, Scrum teams started out in the workshop, right? Oh, the whole lean production line.
Dan Neumann: [16:52] Well, you got, well, you got those lean agile. Oh good. Well, we got a lot of supply chain issues to work out this year from what I understand. So that’s. That’s wonderful. Hey who’s who’s gonna visit agile Santa next, Misi.
Misi Eyetsemitan: [17:08] We have a fantastic agile thinker and coach coming in from some part of north America. I think our name is coach Alba.
Dan Neumann: [17:18] Alba. I think I’ve heard good things about you.
Alba Uribe: [17:23] Oh, I’m so excited to be here. Thank you, Santa.
Dan Neumann: [17:28] Oh, we we’re excited to have you here. Yeah. I’ve heard you’ve done some podcast things before, eh.
Alba Uribe: [17:34] Yeah. Yeah. That has been great. That has been one of the good things for this year.
Dan Neumann: [17:41] Now. Now that hat you got there is that one of those hats of a Scrum master I keep hearing about,
Alba Uribe: [17:46] Yeah. I, I put on my hat of a Scrum master just to be a servant leader.
Dan Neumann: [17:52] Oh, that’s good. Yeah. That hat scream servant leader. It’s let’s see for those who are just listening to the audio. It’s green with giant white elfish ears. We got we got a tassel bob thing on all. That’s great. Oh, good stuff. So have, have you been a good coach this year?
Alba Uribe: [18:09] I have been a great coach. Yeah. I have been helping organizations and teams to do agile and get that, get into the agile mindset and embrace Scrum. The Scrum framework, get all the value that agile provides organizations deliver value faster so that I I’ve been good.
Dan Neumann: [18:34] Oh, I, I love it. Now you said do agile, are you one of those coaches that gets hung up on doing agile versus being agile?
Alba Uribe: [18:42] No, I’m being agile too. Yeah. Sometimes it’s good. I do agile. I teach it, but I also embody that all the qualities that an agile person should have.
Dan Neumann: [18:56] Ooh, that’s good. I hate hypocrites boy. That thrusts my cupcakes. You got those command and control self-organizers. Oh, oh my God. That bugs agile Santa to no end.
Alba Uribe: [19:07] And that is in the past that’s many years ago. Many years ago. I’m being good.
Dan Neumann: [19:16] Oh, angel Santa used to waterfall project. All he, yeah. We always just used requirements. Yeah. Yeah. So what what’s on Alba’s Christmas list this year.
Alba Uribe: [19:26] Yeah. So my top item is to have organizations embrace the agile mindset. So that’s my please, please, please. Santa. Help me with our clients to embrace all the value that agile can bring, that they understand how great it is and how, how much of benefits they can get on the return on investment and all that. So understanding and embracing change. That’s my main wish.
Dan Neumann: [20:07] Hey, Misi you, you know, if we still got any magic dust go on on there in the, in the Elf shop, any of this, any of this agile dust it’s I don’t know. That’s the, the supply chain. It might be sitting on ships out in the Pacific there somewhere.
Misi Eyetsemitan: [20:21] Bad service over here of Santa, but we sure do have some dust, some magic dust to help Alba. I will be sending some her way.
Alba Uribe: [20:29] Oh, that’s great. Thank you. I need that please. I need that very badly.
Dan Neumann: [20:35] Good. I love it. Yeah. We’ll get you some of that magic transformation dust there. Oh, good. Well, Alba, you have a wonderful 2022 and, and I hope the, that that real poser Santa. I hope he brings you some good stuff too.
Alba Uribe: [20:49] Thank you. Thank you, Santa. Thanks.
Dan Neumann: [20:51] Oh, oh, Misi. That was wonderful. Yeah, we like Alba. Oh good. Yeah. Who’s who’s next on our list.
Misi Eyetsemitan: [20:57] So we have a fantastic coach who is on the, on the, on the good list from the east coast of North America. Well, Rosemary.
Dan Neumann: [21:11] Hello Rosemary. How are you doing today?
Rosemary Atanga: [21:14] Great.
Dan Neumann: [21:15] Oh, it’s nice for you to join agile Santa.
Rosemary Atanga: [21:20] I’m glad to meet you. And Elf Misi.
Dan Neumann: [21:24] Yeah. Now I got a question Rosemary as a coach, as so Elf Misi was talking to me while we were at a little break here and she was like, I’m the head elf? And I thought, boy, I don’t know if I’m okay. Having an elf who’s trying to use positional authority to get everybody to do things. What do you think Elf Misi’s given me a dirty look, we’re gonna have to talk about that.
Rosemary Atanga: [21:50] I, I think being the head is also like being the the person who drives success. So I like him. I like Misi taking that role as the you know, the, the, the elf.
Dan Neumann: [22:10] I do too. No, she’s a great elf. I was just a little concerned there that, that she might try and you know, lead through through power and not, not that whole leading by serving thing that I hear all those agile coaches talking about so much.
Rosemary Atanga: [22:24] I think the, the, the seven leader is also the head, the coach. Okay. The, you know, the coach, the head and as well as the servant.
Dan Neumann: [22:35] Oh, is that how you see yourself there? Misi. Oh yeah. Oh, okay. That’s a big smile and a nod. Oh boy. Yeah. That’s good stuff. So Rosemary, Elf Misi said you’ve been good. What, what’s an example of something that I’m gonna see here on my, my good list.
Rosemary Atanga: [22:53] I try to look out for everybody and make sure that they’re doing what they’re supposed to do and give them the support that they need.
Dan Neumann: [23:02] Oh, that’s good stuff. Yeah. Yeah. And I heard you brought some fun into the, the teams and the practice, so that’s good stuff there.
Rosemary Atanga: [23:08] That’s right.
Dan Neumann: [23:11] So so tell me what, what what kind of things are you looking for from, from agile Santa here? This Christmas?
Rosemary Atanga: [23:18] I am looking for agile. I’m looking for agile Santa to wave the magic wand so that all the outstanding things that we are waiting for should happen to bring up all the great ideas.
Dan Neumann: [23:37] Oh yeah. Alba Wanted some magic transformation dust too. I, I, Elf Misi, how do we have any more of that?
Misi Eyetsemitan: [23:46] We’re trying to cook up a storm, Santa.
Dan Neumann: [23:50] Oh yeah. Supplies are a little short. We’ve talked about the supply chain and the labor shortage. Rosemary. I don’t, I don’t know. I’m not even sure what raw materials go into that. I have to defer to my elves, but oh, my transformation takes a long time. Eh, doesn’t it.
Rosemary Atanga: [24:05] That’s right. It does.
Dan Neumann: [24:07] Yeah. So do you struggle with the patience there with transformation?
Rosemary Atanga: [24:14] I, I try to be patient all the time.
Dan Neumann: [24:17] Oh, good for you. Does it working?
Rosemary Atanga: [24:20] I think patience, it’s a, it’s a virtue in, in the environment where we work. You always have to be patient, but you still have to be assertive.
Dan Neumann: [24:30] Whoa. That, that sounds tricky there. Walking that fine line between patience and assertive. Yeah. That’s good. That must be why these coaches get all the big bucks.
Rosemary Atanga: [24:40] That’s right.
Dan Neumann: [24:42] Oh, good. Good. Well, anything else you you’re thinking about this year? Christmas and agile Santa thing?
Rosemary Atanga: [24:50] Well, I, I think Santa should look out for coming up with ways to keep all of us motivated and encouraged giving us all good things that we need to keep our practice the best in the world.
Dan Neumann: [25:05] Oh, good. I, I hear like having a vision’s really helpful. So we’ll, we’ll see if we can’t keep that vision thing aligned and I dunno, maybe we’ll sprinkle some OKR dust around. Oh. The people love those objectives and key results there.
Rosemary Atanga: [25:19] Yes.
Dan Neumann: [25:20] Yes. Well, thank you for visiting Rosemary. Really appreciate you have a wonderful Christmas.
Rosemary Atanga: [25:25] Thank you, Santa.
Dan Neumann: [25:27] Oh, thank you. So Misi, we didn’t, we didn’t talk about what the elves want for Christmas this year.
Misi Eyetsemitan: [25:36] We have a whole list for you. It’s on your desk.
Dan Neumann: [25:40] Oh, is it ordered? I can’t. It can’t all be priority.
Misi Eyetsemitan: [25:43] It’s been prioritized.
Dan Neumann: [25:46] Oh, are there acceptance criteria? I hear those are helpful too.
Misi Eyetsemitan: [25:50] There’s a benefit to each one.
Dan Neumann: [25:52] Ooh. Like a real, like a real business value. Yes. Oh, good. Good. Now use the user story format or, or just any old type of backlog.
Misi Eyetsemitan: [26:02] Oh, we definitely use user story format.
Dan Neumann: [26:05] Oh, oh, good. I hear, yeah.
Misi Eyetsemitan: [26:07] I mean, they’re all, they’re all estimated. They’re just waiting for you.
Dan Neumann: [26:12] Well, we’ll we’ll we’ll set up a queue. We’ll pull some of those that we’re, we’re kind of a we’re not terribly iterative up here in the north pole. We kind of flow based. So we’ll we’ll see what we can’t get cranked out here. Okay. Well, Hey, Hey, Misi, Elf Misi. Thank you for, for helping out really. Oh, those are lovely jingle bells. And I wanna take a second to thank all the listeners for bearing with us through this. This agile Santa episode. Oh yeah. Hopefully they come back. Yeah. Thanks listeners. Really appreciate it. And we’ll see if Dan’s back next week. I might just keep the job. We’ll see. Well, thank you. You guys have a Merry Christmas.
Outro: [26:58] This has been the Agile Coaches’ Corner podcast brought to you by AgileThought. The views, opinions and information expressed in this podcast are solely those of the hosts and the guests, and do not necessarily represent those of AgileThought. Get the show notes and other helpful tips for this episode and other episodes at agilethought.com/podcast.